I think that we are often socially conditioned with attitudes to weather conditions are good or bad. Nature makes no big deal about it and my grandson loves being out in the wet splashing in puddles . I've never heard him complaining about any weather conditions . We used to be like that didn't we ? . The conditioning comes later in life.
You must ask yourself Doug, if it were really black dark, pissing down, cold and very windy, would you prefer to stand at the helm of an aft cockpit yacht in hat, boots and foulies or be inside, in a comfortable swiveling upholstered seat with arm rests in tee shirt and shorts, all the nav station laid out in front, no raindrops on your specs?
I still don’t get this concept.
You must ask yourself Doug, if it were really black dark, pissing down, cold and very windy, would you prefer to stand at the helm of an aft cockpit yacht in hat, boots and foulies or be inside, in a comfortable swiveling upholstered seat with arm rests in tee shirt and shorts, all the nav station laid out in front, no raindrops on your specs?
If you answer truthfully, and the aft cockpit yacht dressed up for the foul conditions is a yes, can we assume you would ignore the shelter of a garden shed and stand outside on the lawn in the wind and pissing rain?
First Mate and I have owned three aft cockpit yachts before our current boat. We have endured the weather in the fag-end of the night watches on long passages. With good clothing it is OK. We tend to do in excess of 1500 NM's each year, many night passages as we prefer to arrive at our destination in daylight. We travel farther and faster now, and arrive fresher and more relaxed.
Our previous boat, an Island Packet 350, gave us the night passage of our lives.
We had left Portland, inside passage at dusk. By the time we had rounded the Bill and taken a board North to miss the tail of the race it was getting dark. First Mate was taking a nap, I was sitting in a corner seat, main pegged in tight, engine on, heading for Brixham across Lyme Bay, into a rising 5.
The ensign started flapping across my face-wind had changed! Got the staysail and genoa out, freed the sheets and we sailed in perfect conditions down the moonbeam across Lyme Bay. We made a perfect landfall at Brixham entrance, the best night sail we ever had.
We would not be having this exchange of views were it always so - but it is not!
Before we bought our current boat we made two columns, 'Must Haves' and 'Nice to Haves'.
The SP Cruiser was the nearest to fullfiling what we required. I sold my collection of 32 Vintage, Classic and Racing motorbikes to assist in funding the purchase.
The 'we' is a very important part of that short sentence. Our sailing, like our life together, is a partnership.
Without our current vessel or something similar, I would be sailing on my own. The right boat has kept both of us enjoying sailing.
Result!
The point, which I make often but which seems to be wilfully or just inevitably misunderstood, is the benefit of the option to steer indoors. Not imprisonment in an airless overheated cabin; just the option, and only for as long as it is preferred, to avoid spending watches enduring all weathers.
Quite different...you must recognise that as being the point we've attempted to make over so many pages? I suspect you do, but you refuse to be seen to.
I think all of us that prefer an open cockpit are quite happy to accept that sheltered helms are desired, but by a minority of boat buyers. My favourite place to sit and steer boat is on the coaming aft, leaning back against the pushpit with the tiller extension in my hand. I have a great view forward over the coachroof. My view is not blocked by a big ol’ wheelhouse, which suits me.
I agree with the basic sentiment, but disagree with your post #103.
If you were steering a wheelhouse/pilothouse vessel your vision would not be blocked-you would be looking through a protective screen, inside, keeping dry and warm.
You talk as if the option to steer from inside is a feature that is completely detached from the rest of the boat. That you could have a boat with whatever performance you wanted and slap an inside helm on it and job’s a goodu’n.
Pre-supposing your 'protective screen' is not continually being sluiced by breaking waves or lashing rain, if it were your visibility might be impaired more than the daft bugger sat in his open cockpit, certainly with regards to spotting something like an unlit fishing buoy, that helmsman in the open cockpit also has more/better opportunities to move about to see around/past fixed obstructions in his field of vision.
Granted, pi$$ed me off as well, but haven't been able to figure out yet why it downloaded like that. Any suggestions welcomed.
Wow. Are we in danger of getting a replacement for the mythical Andersen 22?
I'm glad he found what he wanted, that really is all that matters.
I'm in that same position, and I too have never raced, nor had any desire to start. I like summer sailing for the peace and independence, and the fulfilment of a free ride. If the boat is doing her best, then I've done mine - actual speed under sail amid modern traffic is scarcely significant.
Two different forms of boating, theoretically requiring two different boats. The pity of the problem is how little research and development has pursued a good compromise, largely because sailing men are so resistant to its advance. Laminar Flow has done great work improving the sailing of a hull widely believed only good for motoring, allowing both the fulfilling pursuit of actively sailing her, or utter relaxation under power.
Sotonmet says force 5/6 SW, and the rain appears to be an all-nighter. Would you honestly rather be sitting outside?
Everything's been said at least thrice, and nobody has any interest in changing what they thought already. Good ol' forum. Goodnight!
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I agree, I think Laminar Flow has done a great job in modifying his boat to meet his needs . Hopefully, it may give other motorsailor's confidence to make changes if they want to.I'm glad he found what he wanted, that really is all that matters.
I'm in that same position, and I too have never raced, nor had any desire to start. I like summer sailing for the peace and independence, and the fulfilment of a free ride. If the boat is doing her best, then I've done mine - actual speed under sail amid modern traffic is scarcely significant.
But for me, life is too short to pay what boat ownership costs, just to spend precious leisure days working against inevitable headwinds in our grotty climate. The summer isn't long or reliable enough, and the rest of the year is money burned as berthing fees.
If all our weather was the best of summer, it really would be different. On this breezy February night (I hear the rain slamming the window), nothing would persuade me aboard any open cockpit yacht; but even now, I believe a passage in Laminar's wheelhouse would be very agreeable.
I like the ability of displacement motorboats to provide imperturbable calm en route without obliging the crew in any way, least of all keeping them on deck in conditions which, on shore, would drive all but loons indoors. Only the cost of fuel clouds the motorboat scene.
Two different forms of boating, theoretically requiring two different boats. The pity of the problem is how little research and development has pursued a good compromise, largely because sailing men are so resistant to its advance. Laminar Flow has done great work improving the sailing of a hull widely believed only good for motoring, allowing both the fulfilling pursuit of actively sailing her, or utter relaxation under power.
Sotonmet says force 5/6 SW, and the rain appears to be an all-nighter. Would you honestly rather be sitting outside?
Everything's been said at least thrice, and nobody has any interest in changing what they thought already. Good ol' forum. Goodnight!
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Just so. As a sailor of the polar opposite of a motorsailor, we are rarely cold or wet. We have a sprayhood and good waterproofs, and modern layered warm gear. And anything else is the price we pay for performance. I personally can’t see the point of starting with a boat designed to be a poor sailer, and making into a mediocre one, but if the OP is pleased with his creation, great. Theres much to love about making something your own. I have no doubt he’s improved it’s sailing ability. Whether it’s as quick as an Andersen 22, there's only one way to find out!
